Why Attracting a Good Indian Girl is a Challenge

by Sharell शारेल on October 26, 2011

in Culture Shock in India, Daily Life in India

Post image for Why Attracting a Good Indian Girl is a Challenge

The problem of finding a decent Indian guy has been discussed quite a bit around here. But attracting a good Indian girl isn’t any easier — in fact, it’s probably more difficult.

This was confirmed by one reader who commented, “Attracting a good-cultured Indian girl is much more hard than attracting a good-cultured Western Girl. And no one knows it better than Indian guys”.

I dare say a white friend of mine from America knows it quite well too. His saga (and failure) is chronicled here, here, and here. He did actually attract a very good Indian girl. They spent quite a bit of time together, but all his attempts to have a relationship with her met with frustration.

Obviously, the issue is problematic not just for my friend, but for Indian guys as well. So much so, that a book has been written about it. It’s called, The Bad Boy’s Guide to the Good Indian Girl by Annie Zaidi and Smriti Ravindra. They “lift the veil (or sari pallu) on the lives and loves of girls who have been born or raised in the subcontinent”.

The authors were inspired to write the book because of all the Indian men who complain that they simply cannot understand women, particularly Indian women. They actually sympathise with the plight of the Indian man because they know there’s cause for confusion and resentment.

If you’re an Indian guy, have you ever approached an Indian girl but were treated like a pervert when you asked for her name? Or have you given a girl a fancy present but she was too nervous to accept it?

But why? What’s going on and what causes it?

In a recent interview in the Mumbai Mirror, the authors gave the example of how they were instructed not to talk to boys outside when they were undergraduates and living at a very strict girls college. Some girls obeyed. Some didn’t. However, those who talked to boys would give out fake names and fake addresses. As the authors say, “it must’ve been frustrating for boys when they discovered the lie, but on the other hand, what’s a good girl to do?”

Indeed, if the boys had real names and real phone numbers, they’d try and call. The hostel warden would find out. Parents would be summoned. The authorities would tell them that their daughters were up to no good. The girls would be shamed in front of their families, and their families would be shamed in front of the college authorities. So, did the girls really have a choice?

While compiling their book, the authors asked themselves, “how does one get labeled as bad, or not very good, or at least not a good Indian girl?

The consensus amongst themselves and the people who they asked was that clothes have a lot to do with the stereotype. Interestingly, so does body shape. A stereotypical good Indian girl is expected to not just dress “within limit” but also to somehow make her body look well restrained and cautious. “Limits”, or course, are very hard to define. Apparently, it’s not enough to wear a sari for instance. If you look sexy in a sari, then even that might earn you a bit of social censure.

So, when a girl spends hours trying to make up her mind about what to wear, in India she’s not just worried about looking good. She’s also worried about appearing to be good.

Seemingly, the big issue is that while it’s considered healthy for good Indian girls to be interested in boys, acting on that interest is troublesome territory. How much interest can you show without suffering for it? Can you go out drinking late at night? Can you buy him a drink without being laughed at for being “desperate”? Can you sleep with him and still have him treat you with respect?

Many guys wonder why Indian girls care so much about being seen as a “good girl”. The reason why is if they are seen as “not good girls”, they aren’t treated with respect. Their families aren’t treated with respect. And when things go bad, the girls’ pain and outrage is even turned as a weapon against them. According to the authors, they see it happening time and time again through news reports about girls who are assaulted or harassed.

The questions everyone immediately asks are, “What time was it? Why was she out alone. Did she know the boy(s). What was she wearing? Did she live alone? Why?”

Therefore, overwhelming problem for Indian girls is that a great web of morality confronts them.

The authors do give some advice for attracting a good Indian girl. Not surprisingly, it’s centered around respect.

  • Show respect for all girls. NEVER say things like, “she had it coming” or “she is a nympho” or “girls who smoke are more likely to put out”.
  • NEVER hint that there’s a separate set of rules for girls and guys. She knows the rules, and will hate you for reminding her.
  • DO NOT ask about her sexual history. Let her volunteer the information if she wants to. A girl’s secrecy is often the only defense she has.

As the authors conclude, most Indian girls end up breaking some rules. And what’s more, they do want to. The challenge lies in snatching a bit of joy and freedom for themselves and not getting caught.

My conclusion: although Indian guys are often portrayed badly, I would MUCH rather be an Indian guy than an Indian girl!

Photo credit: Heavenhated.

23 people like this post.
© Copyright 2011 Sharell शारेल, Diary of a White Indian Housewife 2008-2014. All Rights Reserved. Do not copy and reproduce text or images without permission.

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{ 90 comments… read them below or add one }

Kay October 26, 2011 at 1:57 pm

Happy Diwali

Hmm–I think different pockets of Indian society have different kinds of men and women. My fiance for example, grew up in Hyderabad and went to a school in which people dated (just like they did in my high school in the US) and the parents were okay with it. It’s pretty funny considering that a lot of the people in the friends group actually dated one another in high school. So, I think, a lot of male and female behavior and lack of dating skills has to do with the kind of background in which one is raised.

What I have noticed, particularly with Indian women from this pocket of society, is that they would be considered extremely high maintenance when compared to Western women. Indian women born and raised here–from this branch of society–take the cake. So while there are no fake names or numbers given, there are certain kinds of demands like iphones or the newest blackberries or clothes or hand bags.

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Helene October 26, 2011 at 3:21 pm

Sharell, reading your last two articles I can’t help thinking about the autobiographical novel “Marrying Anita” by Anita Jain, where the author tells of all her attemps to find a suitable relationship in India. I had the idea of a puritan India, but finally there is much similarity in what she describes in New Delhi and in New York.

Then it reminds me about conversations with my hubby when he asked many times how I could travel alone and I told him how any woman in any country must take care of her own safey and never put herself in awkward situations and that maybe he didn’t notice it but I was doing exactly that and was always calculating people and situations. He went on to tell me that in some circumstances, he asks friends to go with him.

Ok, maybe I’m old hat but why would your friend expect it easy to have a RELATIONSHIP with a 23 year old from Uttar Pradesh ?

We had this funny conversation about the concept of true virgins, which he told me is a philosophical concept and I told him is offensive. He told me just like a lady expect her husband to be faithful after marriage, a man expects his wife to be a true virgin at her wedding… Right. I need to find out more about that :)

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Sharell October 26, 2011 at 3:40 pm

Ok, maybe I’m old hat but why would your friend expect it easy to have a RELATIONSHIP with a 23 year old from Uttar Pradesh ?

Simply because he had no idea as to why not! ;-)

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Mohit gupta October 26, 2011 at 5:26 pm

“expect it easy to have a RELATIONSHIP with a 23 year old from Uttar Pradesh ?”

Yes ! UP is much more liberal than it is thought to be.Take a case of my relatives/family of UP.There is no Religion/Caste in the world whose guys/girl haven’t married into my family/Relatives.Yes there were some friction as they would be in any country or society whenever two people of different class/community/race are involved. And please note that we are from a typical north-Indian Hindu family from a very backward town in western UP , near Agra.

The thing is that , you can not generalize any smallest group of people/region of India.You can find most conservative , narrow-minded and rich people in Mumbai , which is considered to be most-liberal city.And you can find most liberal , easy-going and broadminded , though religious , people in India.

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Mohit gupta October 26, 2011 at 5:14 pm

Sharell ,

“My conclusion: although Indian guys are often portrayed badly, I would MUCH rather be an Indian guy than an Indian girl!”

Is that an expression of eternal rivalry and jealousy between girls. ? :):):)

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Shivani October 27, 2011 at 10:24 am

I don’t think so. She just means that Indian girls get too many rules and little/no fun!

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Sharell October 27, 2011 at 10:25 am

Right! :-)

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Mohit Gupta October 27, 2011 at 10:52 am

Oh ! Girls know each better then guys.It has been proved once again.

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tina October 26, 2011 at 7:20 pm

Wow, this was an eye opener for me. I first laughed at the title. In america, every girl yearn to tame a bad boy. The good guys in turn get stuck with a jaded or damage women. In reading this further this reminds me of all the new bollywood type of movies. I love bollywood but more and more they are pushing the sterotype of a western women and saying that its better to be a western women, strong, fun, easy, but not too easy and she can do whatever she wants. Apparently, in reading this she can’t do whatever she wants for fear of shaming the family.
Does that mean these indian men are more influenced by the bollywood women? They think that all college girls act like they do on film?

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gps October 27, 2011 at 11:40 am

In america, every girl yearn to tame a bad boy. The good guys in turn get stuck with a jaded or damage women.

I’m sorry but this is just so wrong.

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Mohit Gupta October 27, 2011 at 11:54 am

Tina ,

“They think that all college girls act like they do on film?”

NO ! But they certainly wish that all college girl act like they do on film.And there is a reason for that.Nobody want a girl to cry after he proposed her in the college canteen.It was just an isolated example , so please don’t generalize.But I have see it more than once. ;)

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toral October 26, 2011 at 7:40 pm

When I was growing up… I always wanted to be free like a boy and my friends did call me a tomboy! I just felt the lifestyles and restrictions on girls were too much for me to handle and it felt suffocating to see my friends not allowed to do this or that. Even though I dressed like a tomboy and my mannerism were very much like a guy… I was attracted to guys and not girls. Buy guys were obviously not attracted to me… they preferred most demur and girly good girls. But I really did not care so much at that age.
Even the good girls had boy friends who expected them to behave in a particular way. So girls just did not have pressure from their family… a lot of them were finding boy friends who did not want them to have the freedom they enjoyed and fit into the stereotype of what a good girl is suppose to be.
I am glad I was not considered to be a good girl… because then I would have had no fun to live up to that reputation!

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Manny October 26, 2011 at 8:02 pm

Happy Diwali to Sharell and family and all the folks here!

:)

Attracting a good Indian girl requires you acquaint yourself with good families.

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Chelsea October 27, 2011 at 12:03 am

Happy Diwali!!
I found this post interesting as I just returned from Hyderabad where I had an intense experience with my boyfriends parents. Though the new generation often dates and can get away with dressing more openly for the most part (at least in the higher socio economic areas) it all has to do with who you do it around. In front of families of potential suitors girls will dress and act different. I myself found it hard to keep up my good behavior in front of my boyfriends orthodox parents. It’s frowned upon to roll around with a group of guys, drink or acknowledge anything to do with sex. Yet the men can say and do as they please. If uncle makes a lude joke instead of laughing you have to act embarrassed and disgusted. At one point the boys huddled for a funny joke and auntie said that those kind of jokes aren’t meant for good girls ears…I struggled to not roll my eyes. It’s such a double standard.

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Piu October 27, 2011 at 1:33 am

I have to zoom straight to the author’s 3 advice for attracting a good indian girl listed here – rispeck, same rules and ahem sexual hisssstory ???!!!!

are they sure the pearls of wisdone are for indian women ????!!!

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Manny October 27, 2011 at 3:41 am

I think they may have meant, “Do they have a sexual history” not necessarily the details of it.

LOL :)

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Annie October 27, 2011 at 1:43 am

Just for fun … From Goodness Gracious me …Arranged shag

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8kbxA1_1_Sw&NR=1

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Aussie Girl in India October 27, 2011 at 10:26 am

Very interesting article, I really appreciate it seeing it from this perspective. I find just traveling around India as a single woman a mine field, not being entirely sure of how to behave all the time. It is a fine line for as “western” indian woman, I can’t begin to imagine how challenging and constraining it is for the women, and for the men trying to work it all out.

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gps October 27, 2011 at 10:27 am

Indian women are quite unsure about their own tastes in men so if you have/had a girlfriend it validates you. Remain aloof aka don’t message her lovey things or react “on demand”. Act proper at all times. Send her gifts in the post, but only a few months in.

They’re brainwashed into socialism which means anything more specific than “(South) Asian” makes them uncomfortable. And especially don’t show any deep knowledge/interest in her tribal/religious background. Superficial stereotyping or confessed ignorance passed off as humour works best. Besides they’re only into dating because they want to escape all that and the more you gel with them on this the better.

They’re very insecure on issues of cultural fidelity so give them a chance to “defend” it than attack it – which they will if you are patronize them over it. Praise feminism and correct popular misconceptions over the same, especially if you’re Indian. Again ALWAYS make her feel like she’s more conservative and mindful of cultural norms than you (due to said insecurities). Employ the “we are all human” liberal defense.

Read up. Indian women love pop genetics/biology, comparative religion and socio-political theories. Avoid science – Physics/The Universe, Computer Science, Math, Chemistry, Engineering, she would have been force fed that stuff and you can’t explain it well over dinner anyway.

Literature/History-wise, three words – Dead white males. Nobody’s gonna test you, Cliff Notes if you must. They like Germany and European monarchy. Avoid colonialism. Don’t bother with Indian authors like Lahiri Desai etc., it’s usually their favourite, but it shows you’ve stooped to their level. Besides you want to make her feel like the expert on things she has spent a lot of time on. And believe me they lap up morose postcolonial lit, it plays into their solipsism.

Oh and for some strange reason they like guys who’ve hunted. Like rabbit. And can ride a horse.

Apart from characteristics that can be manipulated, they are a few things you should have: If they’re traditional they quite like guys who can get things done on their own. If they’re non-traditional, they like to think they can comfort you (but you shouldn’t be needy about it). Don’t be self-hating, especially about your own religion and culture-gender – have positives to relate from it, rather than blind pride.

If she provokes you, at all costs, do not let her best you over a long argument. Women get an emotional release from whining and arguing endlessly. Don’t try to “reason” or qualify yourself, by indulging them you’re letting them use you, so maintain your boundaries and stubbornly state the facts. If off-guard then clam up claiming fatigue, prepare better and re-approach.

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Sharell October 27, 2011 at 10:31 am

Oh and for some strange reason they like guys who’ve hunted. Like rabbit. And can ride a horse.

That is really bizarre! Not another legacy of the British I hope! :-P

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gps October 27, 2011 at 11:14 am

Oh dear, no hope for us mild-mannered vegetarian types. The best I’ve done is milk a cow.

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Sharell October 27, 2011 at 11:28 am

Hey, milking a cow is quite a skill (I’ve done it and it requires practice). Don’t under rate it. :-)

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Mohit Gupta October 27, 2011 at 11:50 am

No , That is simply not true enough to be generalized on whole Indian girls.I can vouch for the fact that apart from some tom-boyish exceptions , most of Indians girls are VERY fond of pet animals.And they wouldn’t even imagine hurting an animal as innocent and cute as Rabbit.

The exact scenario is that an Indian girl may break up with his guy if she just got to know he killed a rabbit or cat.

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Sharell October 27, 2011 at 10:33 am

But my gosh, I’m really coming to the conclusion that women are too much hard work! And then once you actually are successful in attracting one, they only start to nag you all the time and make life difficult. ;-)

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gps October 27, 2011 at 11:09 am

Come now, it’s all fun and games :). We are not homosexuals.

Indian women, no matter how much they like to think they are “westernized” or iconoclastic, don’t have a whole lot of individuality in breaking out. And therefore somewhat “easier” in my opinion. But maybe it’s because I’m Indian myself?

(White) Western women, on the other hand. Hahaha, that’s a doozy.

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Amit Desai October 28, 2011 at 5:13 pm

It’s all about power, Sharell. Women, liberal or less liberal, always find a way to attain power and manipulate people as much as men do. In India, women try to play hard to get because that gives them a sense of power and superiority. Your social constraints and all that talk is a minor reason. Women are as evil as men and may posses similar bad traits that are comparable to the bad traits of men.

In the West, women have their own ways to attain power and manipulation. A classic example is the sexual assault/rape cases which include a girl friend accusing her ex-boyfriend or close friend. In most of these cases, women accuse their men of rape to get that ‘upper hand’ or dominance/power in the broken relationship.

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gps October 27, 2011 at 10:53 am

By praising feminism, I meant the honest Anglo/Northern European kind. Not the me-quota me-almost-aborted Indians.

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TortoiseMum October 27, 2011 at 10:38 am

Even in Australia’s culture where women are relatively liberated from the kinds of oppressive social structures that shape women’s lives in India, women are still blamed and held responsible for being raped, assaulted and killed. Ideas about good and bad girls seem to be sadly universal. It is such a pity that what’s between a women’s legs still matters so much more than what’s between her ears.

I can’t even imagine how difficult it must be to walk the tightrope of conformity in India for women. In Australia I can own my own house, have a child on my own, have my own career, go on holidays by myself, sleep with whoever I want and it’s really no-one’s business. Most people don’t care. I can’t even imagine how it must feel to be so constrained, and how much that in turn must poison any chance of a true and honest meeting of the minds between women and men in India. The best thing about women’s liberation is that it liberates both women and men from the constraints of gender.

Best of luck girls.

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Sharell October 27, 2011 at 10:45 am

Well said, TortoiseMum.

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Mohit Gupta October 27, 2011 at 12:15 pm

Tortoisemum

Ha ! What a Nick-Name.I absolutely agree with you.But there is a little confusion over some statements.

“In Australia I can own my own house, have a child on my own, have my own career, go on holidays by myself, sleep with whoever I want.”

I don’t know if you have actually visited India or not or what is the level of your actual knowledge about India but many Indian women in Cities , can own house , can have child , can have career , can go on holidays , and also can sleep with whoever they want and they actually DO. But the only difference is that it become a business of other in TALKS , thought non one will actively bother them or stop them from doing so , except in some cases their immediate family.

India is not Saudi Arabia actually where from a western point of view or even Indian point of view life for women must be very difficult where they are not even allowed to drive , but when I discussed with this Saudi women they were no qualms about it and told me they mostly love Saudi culture and had a positive attitude towards Burqa and as they told me , even if compulsion to wear Burqa/Abaya is removed they would still wear it.Because , in their opinion, it’s not to hide themselves from other men but their sacred way to connected with the GOD.That was kind of surprising for me and Interesting also as mostly , Saudi women are portrayed as some being oppressed by discriminating rules.

Anyway , I hope for women empowerment without banning/forcing any kind of cloth/custom/culture on them.

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Manny October 27, 2011 at 11:40 pm

I totally agree with you Mohit.

Women have a total right to do whatever and its no ones business… and others have a right to denigrate any behavior they see as slutt or whatever… that’s their free speech right too.

India is like that. Women do exactly what Turtlemom wants…but what she cannot demand is others to cheerlead what she does.

;)

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Abdullah K. October 29, 2011 at 10:28 am

What about acid throwing and harassment by the ‘moral police’ of women who are ‘indecently’ dressed. Not every Indian woman can relocate to Delhi and Mumbai to enjoy the freedom that is her right.

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Mohit Gupta October 29, 2011 at 12:27 pm

Most of the Acid throwing incidents have been in big cities like Delhi , Mumbai , Pune , etc so I think women in small town don’t have to fear it more than they should fear it in cities like Delhi or Mumbai. Also those incident don’t have to do with woman’freedom.These are passion crimes by ultra-sensitive losers who were just dumped by their girl friends.

Those so-called ‘Moral-Police’ are like frogs who comes out only in rain.These guys would react symbolically only on a big occasion like Valentines day of Friendship day and now even they are tired of doing these things.That’s another thing that traditional protesters have become mild and new army of such loosers have been formed in the name of Lord Rama and Bhaghat Singh ! Don’t worry they will perish in no time.

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Mohit Gupta October 29, 2011 at 12:09 pm

Manny ,

Its Tortoisemom and not Turtlemom . you don’t have any right to change the name of her son , ok ? ;)

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Amit Desai October 28, 2011 at 5:26 pm

If women and men are equal, all the conflicts between men and women must have equal footing, more or less. So in many of the rape cases, women are equally at fault. If you think that women are not at fault, then, they are either too superior or too inferior to men. In both cases, the idea of equality is refuted.

Nothing liberates men from the constraints of gender. In a conservative world, men are aggressive bastards who can easily evade rape charges. In a very feminist world, men are subjected to rape, even when it includes a gentle pat or hand-holding only.

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Mohit gupta October 29, 2011 at 1:29 am

Amit ,

” So in many of the rape cases, women are equally at fault.’

I think that is a height of applying technicalities in a question of Morality and sexual violence.Women can NEVER be blamed for an act of physically-strong coward who is morally weak and sexually-hungry.That is like exploring the possibility of finding fault in the person who has just been robbed and murdered in his own house.And no circumstances can justify Rape.

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Amit Desai October 29, 2011 at 2:06 pm

n the U.S, for example, there is category of ‘rape’, and there is a broader category of ‘attempted rape’. The category of attempted rape is still an issue of controversy.

For example, if you have an argument with your wife or girlfriend and you hold her hands or shoulders to explain your point when she wanted to be left alone or go away, you would be charged of ‘attempted rape’ if she complains. So would you become a rapist?

And by the way, rape matters are not as simple as you think, that is, rapists are not necessarily sexually hungry or morally weak. It’s much complicated than that.

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Mohit Gupta October 29, 2011 at 3:05 pm

And by the way, rape matters are not as simple as you think, that is, rapists are not necessarily sexually hungry or morally weak. It’s much complicated than that.

I never said that rape is simple issue.It completely traumatize the victim girl and shakes her conscience.And that is why NOTHING can justify rape.

I think using the words “Sexually Hungry” and ‘Morally-weak” is understatement for rapists but they are simply lecherous and violent beasts who either need to be shot down or electrocuted.

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Amit Desai October 29, 2011 at 4:12 pm

My point is that some women do make false allegations of rape that makes the genuine rape cases even more complicated to analyze. I’m not talking about the obvious-genuine rape cases. I’m not even concerned what punishment the rapist should get. My job is to analyze, not to penalize.

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Mohit Gupta October 29, 2011 at 5:10 pm

“I’m not talking about the obvious-genuine rape cases.”

If you had conveyed this earlier , I wouldn’t have responded.

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Amit Desai October 30, 2011 at 3:28 am

I did and . You didn’t read my first comment, that is made above the one you have responded to. Below is that comment.

“In the West, women have their own ways to attain power and manipulation. A classic example is the sexual assault/rape cases which include a girl friend accusing her ex-boyfriend or close friend. In most of these cases, women accuse their men of rape to get that ‘upper hand’ or dominance/power in the broken relationship.”

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Mohit gupta October 30, 2011 at 1:45 pm

Ok. But I still can’t find the above mentioned comment in this thread or this post.

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Amit Desai October 30, 2011 at 11:18 pm

Because Indians are thoroughly lazy to make efforts.

Below is the complete comment.

Amit Desai October 28, 2011 at 5:13 pm

It’s all about power, Sharell. Women, liberal or less liberal, always find a way to attain power and manipulate people as much as men do. In India, women try to play hard to get because that gives them a sense of power and superiority. Your social constraints and all that talk is a minor reason. Women are as evil as men and may posses similar bad traits that are comparable to the bad traits of men.

In the West, women have their own ways to attain power and manipulation. A classic example is the sexual assault/rape cases which include a girl friend accusing her ex-boyfriend or close friend. In most of these cases, women accuse their men of rape to get that ‘upper hand’ or dominance/power in the broken relationship.

Mohit gupta October 31, 2011 at 1:17 am

But that comment was out of this comment-thread. But yes , I am a lazy-blogger.

Amit Desai October 31, 2011 at 5:37 am

Well, it is posted on the same thread you are blogging. “Why Attracting a Good Indian Girl is a Challenge.”

It’s okay to be lazy. After all, that’s how Indians become no 1 at thinking that they are no 1. LOL.

Colleen at A Curry of a Life October 27, 2011 at 12:06 pm

Hi Sharell – My name is Colleen Mahal. I’m an American from California, married to a Punjabi boy from Bombay. We live in California but are staying in Andheri East till November.

My Husband always told me I seemed more “Indian” than any of the Indian girls who came to the US from India. I guess he thought Indian girls who come to the US try to become more American so it was hard for him as well (worked out great for me though!). Of course, I’ve also always had a fascination with all things Indian, so that helped.

I just love your blog, been following for a while. Love your view point on things, very similar to my own experiences, although I just stay for month long visits and live more vicariously as a resident-Indian through your posts.

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Sharell October 27, 2011 at 12:42 pm

Welcome, Colleen. Thanks for stopping by and introducing yourself. :-)

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Abdullah K. October 27, 2011 at 12:43 pm

One of your best posts so far and the comments are equally insightful. I can understand what your American friend went through, I have been in similar situations myself. My problem with Indian women wasn’t the attracting phase, as I was never the ‘good girl’ hunter, anyway, but dealing with the relationship 2-3 months down the line, when they turn from their normal selves to personality clones of their mothers – bossy, nagging and manipulative. I thought it was a cultural mismatch, but it appears that Indian men are equally flummoxed.
 
Anyway, what is it about the ‘good girl’ that Indian men find attractive? Personally, the good girl I come across seem to be the the ‘indoor’ types who lack a sense of adventure, have weak personalities and (possibly) inhibited sexually. Is it the naivette innocence? Or the possibility of virginity?

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Barns October 27, 2011 at 2:45 pm

Hai Madam I am finding so much of nice Indian girls but they are not loving me, please tell me why I’m not getting…

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Mohit Gupta October 27, 2011 at 3:29 pm

Because , may be , whom you are assuming nice girls are actually Kinnar or Lesbians or may be they know that you are not a very rich white person ..and that why No interest in you..

No Loving , No loving
Only flirting , Only flirting !

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Sharell October 27, 2011 at 4:57 pm

By the way, you might all be interested to know Barns was on the receiving end of a genuine arranged marriage proposal so he could stay in India!!!

http://www.the-nri.com/index.php/2011/07/white-man-marriage-to-indian-woman/

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Mohit Gupta October 27, 2011 at 10:43 pm

That was hilarious offer.Sad that Barn didn’t accept that.

Come on Barn , if we Indians can marry *SOME* not-so-good white women for a Green Card , why should you be left behind and miss an opportunity to stay in Indian for long.

If you had accepted the offer , this girl wouldn’t have scolded in following fashion.

“You westerners (you claim so)come over there and put things into black and white without studying about them in detail.India’s lower castes are already a battered people. Do not insult them more.”

:):):):)

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Manny October 27, 2011 at 11:52 pm

They wonder where they good Indian girls are…when they find one in Kerala, they can’t even hold on to it. Tsk Tsk!

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Abdullah K. October 27, 2011 at 3:44 pm

@ Barns
U iz not trying d frandship line. It is alwys gettng the galz.

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Sharell October 27, 2011 at 4:09 pm

Well, it’s obviously because you don’t have a moustache and aren’t manly enough.

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Abdullah K. October 27, 2011 at 6:02 pm
Sharell October 27, 2011 at 6:06 pm

OMG, has he had hair extensions or what!! :-o

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Murali October 27, 2011 at 6:34 pm
Rebecca October 27, 2011 at 7:02 pm

Hi Barns, I am not an Indian woman but I will offer you my best guess. Many Indian women would face a painful choice between you and their families. An Indian woman I know married an American man and her family disowned her. She has not seen her parents in 25 years and they have never met their grandchildren.

If you really want an Indian woman you might have better luck outside of India. I know several happily married Indian female/white male couples who met in the USA.

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Manny October 27, 2011 at 11:35 pm

I am surprised you had trouble finding women in Kerala. Not too many conservative Hindus girls in Kerala.

:)

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Sharell October 28, 2011 at 12:28 am

I think his reputation was tarnished because he did have a girlfriend (white) living with him for a while…. word must’ve gotten around. :-P

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samee October 28, 2011 at 6:59 pm

Sir, may be you are not trying only to impress them… try try, i think there will be damn good chances they will love you..
;) :p

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Mohit Gupta October 27, 2011 at 10:30 pm

Rebecca ,

“If you really want an Indian woman you might have better luck outside of India.”

Or may be Barn should jump into any “SLUT-WALK” procession and there is a good probability that he may find a good girl there because they are ‘Liberal’ girls.

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Manny October 27, 2011 at 11:54 pm

Actually, he could haunt the “Sepia mutiny.com”. He could find some there too.

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Shivani October 28, 2011 at 5:09 am

What’s wrong with being liberal or a feminist?
If anything India needs more feminists. You should be a feminist. Fighting for women’s rights is not a bad thing. India exploits women much too much and we should all fight it. “Slut Walk” – you don’t understand the concept – it was poorly implemented in India, but I agree with the sentiments.

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Manny October 28, 2011 at 9:05 am

Nothing wrong with a feminist. Its the feminazies that are the problem.

Whats the difference?

A feminist is someone who believes women have a fundamental right to do what they want. As a man, I believe I should have a fundamental right to do what I want within the law. So I can relate…and I am all for it.

But Feminazi believes not only that…but also that others should celebrate what they choose to do and expect others to cheerlead whatever and however they choose to exercise that right. i,e, A woman has a fundamental right to sleep around every day as they choose. Which is true. They do have a basic human right just like a man has that right. Being a libertarian myself, I am all for it. But forgive me for making a crude analogy to get a point across.

As a libertarian I am all for the rights of an Individual to eat their own feces if they choose to. However there would be others shouting at the top of their voice against anyone exercising that right. :P As a libertarian, I am all for the rights of others to express their outrage and even avoiding this person who chooses to exercise their right in such a way that they disapprove.

So.. I am perfectly ok with conservatives who would ostracize and not associate with a woman (or a man for that matter) who is promiscuous.

See?

Remember, the Dixie Chicks episode when they were in the UK they said something unflattering about President Bush and when they got back, the entire south revolved against them by boycotting their music, including calling every single C&W radio station to not play their music. Well the conservative Christian crowd of the US had the same right to do what they did just as the Dixie Chicks had their right to do/say what they felt.

:)

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Manny October 28, 2011 at 9:18 am

In a way, thats how it kind of works in India. Indian women with some exceptions are not tied inside the house and forced to wear a Burkha. Indian women travel on their own and work with men and what not. But its the social expectation and peer pressure that “pressures” them to “behave”. She always has that chose to break out of it if she chooses. She can go on a slut walk every day if she desires.. and some do. But others may choose to behave however they may say fit towards this person as long as they are not physically abusive to the women or in any severe way it infringes on her as a person. No one has that right.

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Shivani October 31, 2011 at 10:12 am

Oh Manny, you have no idea! Be a good looking or not so good looking Indian girl and walk the streets of Delhi. You’ll get raped by eyes. Doesn’t matter what you wear. Doesn’t matter how you act. You will get exploited. It is suffocating.

The feminazis you talk of…well I haven’t met any of those…

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Mohit Gupta October 31, 2011 at 1:01 pm

Shivani ,

You are damn right.But even within Delhi the amount of staring varies according.

People in Delhi behave terrible in this regards.They stare girls in a very obvious and unapologetic manner.Not only on road , while you are walking , but even if you are in the car they will try to have complete look at you.I drive every day with my wife to office and people of all ages starting from 18-80 and people in all cars from Nano to Audi have stared at her.Albeit not without being embarrassed as every time anybody stare at her , I stare them back in their face or jokingly hide her face with my hand. ;)

This is the first thing I would like to improve about Delhi-Males.Apart from staring they are just fine and when you talk to them they would actually become very courteous , in most cases.

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Manny November 1, 2011 at 1:02 am

Delhi is a nasty place for women. Sorry Mohit! LOL :)

Best is have your own car/transportation. no public transportation for women in N.Delhi. You would be assaulted 100%

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Mohit Gupta November 2, 2011 at 3:43 pm

Why you are sorry ? Delhi guys must be sorry for the their desperate stares.Though there is a lot of improvement from last years.But it would take time.Actually asymmetric socio-economic conditions are also to blame.The day most of the people in India have comparable standards of life , the problem of gender inequality shall also be solved leaving only some handful lecherous people to Lust over women.

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samee October 28, 2011 at 12:03 am

Hi Sharell, nice post..
being an Indian girl living in India, i can tell you that we dont always become a supposedly good girl by choice. I wish to give out true numbers and blah blah… but there are lot of things to be considered – like are the girl and the boy just looking for dating or not.. i remember, a friend of mine started going out with a guy.. couple of weeks into the dating and the guy’s friend called her Bhabhi!!! lol. and then there is the issue of the family (talking about Indians, aren’t we??) accepting their daughter’s responses to the advances..
Personally, i wudnt mind dating a guy, Indian or foreigner.. but, if the relation/dating does not work out then some day I have to marry an Indian guy in an arranged marriage… would my future husband accept the fact that I am not a virgin and that I dated several guys??? ( swear, its not a stereotype… desi boys actually want a “pure and untouched girl”.)

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GG October 28, 2011 at 3:13 am

I have to agree with this statement.
( swear, its not a stereotype… desi boys actually want a “pure and untouched girl”.)

Most Indian men want to date “Bold and Brazen” women and it doesn’t matter to them if they had previous relationships but when it comes to marrying someone they want the “Good Girl” who has stayed within her limits and is a virgin.
There is double standard that exists in our Indian society for women that is very hard to get over for most indian men. It does not matter if they have had past relationships or are modern in other ways.
Young Indian women are discouraged from indulging in relationships so they don’t end up having a past .

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v October 28, 2011 at 5:13 am

Hi, interesting to read this.
I come from a moderately conservative family and have been into relationship with both Indian and American men (too courageous for my world, my social circle). Usually the nice respectful ones were too commitment phobic (usually American) and the committed ones were controlling (more often the Indian ones). I finally gave up on men itself, they are far too painful.

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Sharlene October 29, 2011 at 10:41 am

So… because of sexism and female suppression, it is somehow a problem for the man? So lets empathise with how the man feels? I find this perspective very frustrating and perhaps perpetuating the stereotype!

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Abdullah K. October 29, 2011 at 10:43 am

@ Mohit Gupta – “Nobody want a girl to cry after he proposed her in the college canteen.”

It could be worse. My ex-wife fainted after I proposed, was quite a scene. I would take a bucket of tears over that any time.
 

@ Sharell – “…they only start to nag you all the time and make life difficult. “

Hence mankind’s greatest discovery ever – alcohol.

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Katana November 4, 2011 at 4:02 am

You are absolutely right. In fact, I have experienced something myself. Just two weeks ago, a guy from north who understood only hindi was stuck in a problem and apparently no one understood him (I live in south btw). At last he came to our house and I told him where to go and all but then a bunch of women just passed by us and gave us ”ZOMG! what’s going on?!” kinda looks. Honestly, since it’s holidays, I haven’t been going out that much and those stupid looks made me feel stupid but it’s pretty normal here I guess.

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John Carpenter November 6, 2011 at 3:46 am

It’s no wonder so many men–Indian or other–find it difficult to connect with an Indian women: they act as if Indian women are creatures from another planet or believe they come from a culture so mysterious and so often limits to “the other” they are doomed to fail.

It certainly is true that Indians, male and female, have deep-seated cultural beliefs, but what race or citizen of any country doesn’t. I’m an American. You’d have to put a gun to my head to get me to marry a woman selected by my parents–unless, of course, it turned out she was the kind of girl I wanted.

Here’s the real issue:I think everyone on this thread–including the author–views Indian women as Indians first and human beings second. That is to say they believe the Indian women is somehow essentially different than others. The FACT is that if you loked at the heart, blood, or eyes of an Indian woman you wouldn’t be able to distinguish them from any other nationality. Most importantly, EVERY normal human being has a brain hardwired the same way: the brain’s FIRST job (after governing the unity of physiological processes) is to keep the organism out of harms way.
It doesn’t matter if you’re white, black, brown, or yellow. Our brains are all hardwired the same away. The operating sytems may function differently, but it’s the software that’s different–and we all know opinions and deepseated beliefs can be changed. Once you learn how your own brian works, you can take that knowledge and skillfully, compassionately,
and with respect for another’s beliefs or fears, allow them to reflect on them and perhaps change them.

I’d be willing to bet that just about every guy who fails to attain a relationship with an Indian woman was unsuccessful because he tried to change her behaviors and beliefs–or her parents–rather than understand
how is onw brain functioned and how it could provide strategies that would change him in a fundamental way that would allow for the possibility of change in her and obstacles that might have seemed impossible to overcome would seem surmountable.

We’re all the same in the most important ways–that’s the Buddha not me
speaking. If that was not so Bipasha Basu wouldn’t be as big a fan of Lady GaGa as some 17-year-old girl in New York.

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gps November 6, 2011 at 6:21 pm

This is a great example of the “we are all human” defense. It works well because you’ve managed to convince the Indian women you woo that they have deep seated beliefs and are conservative in their cultural behavior, despite the fact that dating itself is liberal by Indian standards and interracial dating, particularly for women, is very liberal by Western standards. Sneaked in some pop-biology too. Genius.

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V November 10, 2011 at 1:34 am

I read the interview by the authors and it made me go down the memory lane when I was working for one the top IT companies who refused to pick me up at my house because the cost was way too expensive. None understood us girls plight of dealing with annoying Indian men who think girls “standing alone” at 5:30AM are an easy catch. There are countless times when men in the deserted streets thought we were whores. Yikes! Pardon my language but thats the truth. Some men even darred to ask if my friend or I was available. I learnt that shouting loudly at them scarred them off. But sometimes I scarred too . Never know how strong the intentions are in their minds.

I was in awe when I heard a strange story from my mom. One time when I was still a school going teen, my mom had just returned to Hyderabad at 5AM. She was pissed that she had to slap a guy – yes she had to – because he was cycling around her and asking her if she was available. Initially, she turned a blind-eye thinking the man would go away, but that short man kept pushing my mom’s patience to the limits. My mom is tall, 5′ 9″, and that guy was may be 5′ 5″? He had the nerve to do this to a tall, grounded and strong-willed mother! I thought at least her height would intimidate the guy.

Having read your posts, I still think India hasn’t progress in these matters. Aweful!

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Manny December 5, 2013 at 4:44 am

“I still think India hasn’t progress in these matters.”

In that statement there is an implicit assumption that 1) India is progressing but not there yet. 2) Men were were worse in those days but we have long way to go.

Sorry to bust the bubble here. Here is the reality

1) India has been regressing since Nehru.
2) Men for the most part behaved themselves in the past.. More and more men in India (having destroyed India’s dharmic culture and values by the Anti Hindu majority), men today are not bound by those “anochronistic” values and morals.

Its getting worse and worse only.

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swati February 3, 2012 at 7:36 am

I absolutely agree with your post! While I empathize with these desperate, frustrated and single Indian men, they are reaping what they (and their male ancestors) have sown!

To add to your point about respect, Indian women are guarded cos they feel unsafe. It only takes a few incidents of bad experiences with groping, leering or more dangerous men to put women/girls constantly on-guard. It doesn’t matter that there are many decent, respectful Indian men out there. Once bitten, forever shy!

Also, India’s gender ratio and the respectable and viable option of an arranged marriage really tips the scales in favor of women today! Why should we waste time getting to know strange men when we can tend to our careers and our ever-important (to men) reputations and wait for a socially sanctioned match?

I am lovin’ it!

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Devika December 4, 2013 at 9:56 am

Very well said. Loving it too.

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Annie May 17, 2012 at 9:48 pm

Hi
I am currently dating a white man from South Africa:)I find them to be more traditional than an American , English , French or other Europeans . Like Australians they have a reputation to be outdoorsy , adventurous and fun loving. I also find him not bothered by all this race talk at all! Intact we’ve never spoken about those differences rather joke about it.from my experience American men are the worst in bed.i don’t understand this good Indian girl talk much. From what I know Indian women are considered fiesty, intelligent and very sexually active. I suppose my education, work sector and social interaction in India has helped me meet amazing indian women not bullied by their tradition and they are all Good Indian girls:)

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Rohan May 25, 2012 at 6:04 pm

Well im an indian guy and a hindu.Id say its the hindu cultural barrier which is too big to break.If u want an indian girl u need to have a large group of male and femal friends.Contacts are important , through which you can get close rather than approaching them as total strangers.Read kunal nayyar(the guy from big bang theory) on youtube , he explains the differences between dating in america and india(if there is any)

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iamtanmay June 6, 2012 at 10:59 am

Thank you so much again, for a vital issue.

I am an indian guy, but I think attracting girls is a non-issue. More importantly, you raise social taboos and different rules for females.

I thank you so much for this. We as a nation have to learn to love and respect each other, male or female. Why do we guys (and girls ! Moms, sisters and friends, they all mistreat other women just as badly !) sexualise and overhype our female halves ? Are we not in this together ?

I wish we could see women as humans just like us men. Objectification of women as sexual objects means we never attribute our human emotions to them. Why, why, oh why ?

I have corrected my male friends often, when they comment on a female friend behind her back. Its her body, her life, why do you intrude ?

We can never become great as long as we degrade half of our society.

Truly it shames me to be a indian man.

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Tommy November 3, 2012 at 3:04 am

Great comments here folks. Keep up the good work. Love to have you guys join me at http://www.Freeheartfinder.com . Please post your comments and blogs freely on this topic or similar topics.

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Paul Cage March 8, 2013 at 9:42 pm

well…. this concludes indian guys are banned from everything while indian girls do have choices.

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jay March 15, 2013 at 8:06 pm

Indian women want the best of everything…they are attracted to soooper rich guys only..!.They are not that much of good marriage material.Uzbek ,turkish women are much more beautiful than indian women and make good wives.

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Sweetlad May 4, 2014 at 1:23 am

Ya gals in India face a lot of difficulty. I’m from Mumbai too and a Muslim gal friend of mine wishes she could be a guy cause of so many restrictions put on her. Even though she drinks with her sisters secretly lol.
And had crushes on guys too and does many other stuffs secretly.
I feel pity for her but there’s nothing I can do for her. And she is nice sweetheart and not a bad gal.
One more thing my Bro met a german gal white and blond through a mutual friend. As it was late my Bro dropped her home and all he could get on way to her home was so many stares even when we were having pav bhaji at a restaurant, the owner himself came out to greet us and I taunted him to too. – saala firang dekhte hi bahar aa gaya lol.

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