Just for a laugh, here’s the “I married an Indian” version of the popular fun board UthinkIdo.
Unfortunately, I can’t claim that I created it. Nor do my in laws think I’m a she-devil (I hope!).
© 2012, Diary of a White Indian Housewife. All rights reserved. Do not copy and reproduce text or images without permission.
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hahahahahahahahahahahahaahahahaha….. I have to show this to my husband!
hi hi ,so u realy cook
Of course! Otherwise, we’d starve or become unhealthy!
If I could “like” this comment… I would
Sharell, which country do you think is the best of the lot to live,work,play-
.United States
.Canada
.Britain
.Australia
.New Zealand
Hi Rahul, I really can’t answer that definitively because I haven’t been to Canada. But out of the countries I’ve been to, I’d pick Australia (maybe I’m biased, but the weather is great, people are really laid back and friendly, the economy is doing well. It’s also really beautiful and uncrowded).
Gr8, my cousin brother lives in Sydney since 2001 or 2002. He said its awsome. i dunno y….but i am afraid of Australians :p
Oh you shouldn’t be. We can be a bit loud and boisterous, but we’re much friendlier than the Americans!
Glad he loves it!
I agree with Sharell.
Australia with all of its ‘racists’ is one of the best country to live and work. The best part about it is the stability of economy and society and last but not its water-life.
Let me tell you, Rahul, that Canada is beautiful! Visit one day if you can
There’s a Canadian girl living in my house in Melbourne — she’s awesome! Down to earth and super friendly. 8) She came to Oz on a working tourist visa around 4 years ago, and ended up getting a great job and decided to stay on.
@Sharell To be frank and honest, like most people from developing countries, i also have that “American/Canadian/Australian” dream of living and working in a “New World” country. I hope i am in Canada/Australia/USA before the end of this decade.
I know this sounds straightforward and direct (ppl can consider me as a weirdo and freak, especially the white women) but another reason is i really like white women and hope to fall in love with one and marry (i am good guy, i don’t drink,smoke….hell i don’t even drink Tea,Coffee,Milk…now match that)
However, my friends say migrating to a Western country is not a good idea, they say it will ruin my kids and make them Totally “American”. i am confused abt this though.
Hi Rahul, you’ll have to go abroad and check it out and see what you think. You might find that you have problems getting a “good woman” though, because the way the west is, most women will drink alcohol, and will usually drink tea/coffee etc too. It’s a very different way of living than in India. If that doesn’t bother you, then it could work out for you!
If you do have a child in another country, it’s only natural that the child will follow that culture. However, if your western wife also has an interest in India, you will be able to retain some of your culture in the home. However, your child will very much have a western mentality, having grown up in the west.
Really, you need to go there, and see if that way of life agrees with you. It’s very different to India.
@Sharell, i absolutely don’t have any problems with other people drinking, seriously i don’t. I know its very cold there and ppl have to drink to keep themselves warm.
I know that, if the kid is born in the West he/she will follow western culture. i agree with that. I don’t have anything against western culture.
In fact i want my wife to retain her Western/Christian values because that’s her identity. I don’t want her to convert or become fully Indian etc etc. In anycase i am not really that religious, i never was and never will.
The point to doing a Interreligious/Interracial marriage is to mix your values/culture with your wife’s values/cultures, or else you should marry within your own community.
Definitely! But most people don’t drink to keep warm.
It’s a social thing, whether winter or summer (in fact, many people drink more in summer, particularly in Australia when getting together with friends for barbeques etc all the time).
Well, i dunno why but ever since i was a kid i am somewhat attracted to Canada. I don’t know why its only Canada and not USA,Australia,UK,New Zealand.
I have never been out of India, i haven’t been out of Bombay for last 8yrs.
Canada – Its like i just have to go there. I dunno why but i just have to go there. Maybe i was Canadian in my past life :p
Rahul, Why would being American “ruin” your kids? My children and many of my friends and family are American and we are not “ruined”. There are all types of people who behave in all of sorts of ways in every country. If you are not comfortable with your future children being American, these please do not move to America.
@Rebecca, i don’t think that way, that’s what most Indian families think. They think kids in America go wayward after 16 or 17. I know there are ppl like these in all countries. But one thing i will have to say that American Parenting skills needs a check.
Btw i am NOT moving to America, Its Canada or Australia for me,
So Chillax
Rahul I would really appreciate it if you actually visited America before assuming that our children are “ruined” and that “American parenting skills need a check.” Are there are incompetent parents in America? Yes of course there are, as there are in every country. However, the fact remains that millions of foreigners, including over a million of Indians, have sought to immigrate to America, whereas millions of Americans have not sought to immigrate to India. So perhaps American parents must be doing something right to make raise children that grow up to make their country such a desirable place to live.
I have been to India many times and observed many Indians in the US. While there are many types of parents, I have noticed a propensity of Indian children to be spoiled and immature, maybe because their parents need their skills checked?
am an indian and have a 3 yr old kid, and wish i had the american parenting skills. my kid is somewhat spoilt. it is my fault and i dont have much control now, she is being brought up by her grandparents. ( challenged life circumstances )
parenting skills are something that get passed on through generations and its hard to cross skill over to different cultures, for lack of visibility into how another home in a different culture functions. i wish we had that visibility.
How interesting. I actually had very similar perspective about Canada vs US before traveling to either of these places.
So when it came to apply for grad school, I actually applied to a bout 5 Canadian university/college and just 1 US university. I got admission for most of those and so I decided to do some tourism and also check out these schools. Obviously I went to Canada first. The foreign admissions office guy at York University in Toronto was out rightly racist towards me, I wish I had a hidden video camera and could have taped the entire conversion so I could have uploaded it you tube.
There have been only twice where someone has been openly racist towards me and both times it actually happened in Canada. I have lived here in the US for almost 20 years and not once have I encountered open racism towards self. Not saying that is the overall trend of canada…but thats my story.
Now, having lived here in the US for so long, I can tell you, among all the western countries I have traveled to, US is the best and probably the least racist among western countries. I suspect, the rest of the western countries are just catching up.
What could be attractive about Canada to some desies is that Canada is one of leftist countries out there in their politics which may be a natural fit for liberal left desies.
However, if you want a new perspective and learn how wrong it is to be a liberal left, the US could really open desies eyes about about how wrong they have been with such attitude…
JMO.
@Manny Thanx 4 d advice. I will really remember this before going to the “WILD WILD WEST”
@Rebecca – Maybe you are right. All these facts are into most Indians mind that Americans are ruined. And yes, there are many many “ruined” ppl in India too. Indians are hypocrites and in no way are “pure” good.
Actually we all have been told here in India, that Americans take everything for a joke.
Once my dad just joked that if i go to USA, then i should find myself a American woman, and to this my mum got somewhat pissed off and said “NO AMERICAN”.
See my cousin brother married a American and got divorced, even his brother married a American and they have a son now. When they had come to India many years back and we met them after they left my dad actually said that “she” will just stay for another 6-7months and divorce him. So basically Indian parents have this mentality that if you marry a Western woman, you are most likely going to become a divorcee in a couple of years and a Western woman cannot be a good mother to her kids.
I want to go to USA, but i doubt i will get the Visa :p
BTW my cousin brother is hindu and he “baptized” his son rather than telling him to follow Hinduism. If you were married to a Non-American/Non-Christian what would you prefer for your kids – being christian or non-christian?
Manny, as an alumnus of York and a Canadian, I’m curious about when this all happened to you. I assume 20 years ago, around the same time you settled in the U.S.? Canada 20 years ago is a very different country. Toronto 20 years ago is a completely different city.
The largest minority group who studies at York is Indo-Canadians and NRIs. South Asians are the largest minority group in Canada (beating Chinese then Blacks for visible minorities though all are trumped by French-Canadians, the linguistic minority). Also, today, 49% of people who live in Toronto were born in another country. I don’t in the least disbelieve your experience but want to point out that it is likely not typical.
Btw, considering your dislike of the left, it’s somewhat amusing to me that you applied to York, considering it’s the bastion of left-wing radicalism in English Canada.
You probably didn’t know that, I’m assuming. 
Also, Canada currently has a Conservative gov’t and Prime Minister, and the economy here is doing much better than the U.S. 
I think Indians would find either Canada or Australia easier to navigate than the U.S. because the political structures are essentially the same. Canada has the advantage of having a huge South Asian presence in all its large cities, meaning its relatively easy for Indians to move here and access existing support networks. The big shock is usually the cold!
_____________
All that said, I really loved the Indian version of the funboard, Sharell. Very funny!
Sorry Sharell.. this has gone a tad OT.
Hi Jashn.
Yeah it was early 90s. and later have travelled to other parts … Vancouver/BC is my fav place in Canada.
I didn’t know York was liberal bastion.. but then it wouldn’t have mattered since I was one of em… Oh the Horror! Ha Ha. Most Indians who are educated are liberal left for the most part. Thats the problem in India. It’s just one point of view. Unhealthy. All of us are children of liberal left ideology. So many of us who come to the US are democrats by default…it takes a lot of introspection and understaning America before I started seeing the “Truth”! Ha HA!
As for as cold.. you are right on. I would say, that played a big part for me to move south of the border. I had just come from Istanbul during April first week.. and Istanbul during April is just warm and sunny and I was dressed for Summer and I was caught offguard by the cold of Toronto and had to borrow my friends jacket during those two weeks.
Finally I agree with Manny
After interacting and befriending guys from the Red states, I have become an Independent from a democrat guy.
But still, I can’t watch Fox TV. It spoils my mood, and I still wonder how two American states have Governors of Indian origin and incidently both of them are Republicans!
Manny,
This time I can’t resist to ask but what actually “Liberal-Left” mean? I am asking because sometimes I think you are blaming people or societies on their ‘Liberal-Leftism’ when they are not the one. Like Congress- I hate this one-family , sickular party as much as you do but I can’t say its ‘Liberal-Leftist’. Because a ‘Liberal-Leftist’ won’t ever lick the toes of minority community for votes as Congress do. In my view they are another kind of right-winger who can kill Sikhs in hoards but still call themselves “secular”.
@Rebecca
”However, the fact remains that millions of foreigners, including over a million of Indians, have sought to immigrate to America, whereas millions of Americans have not sought to immigrate to India. So perhaps American parents must be doing something right to make raise children that grow up to make their country such a desirable place to live”
Dear Rebecca,Indians as from other nations will always immigrate to America given a chance because survival is easy.It is less competitive lifewise in the United States than in India given that we have a billion population which also means that there will be no old age pensions and other benefits since our govt can’t afford to feed a billion mouths.These are the things which might attract Indians to emigrate.Likewise even we must have done something right to be qualified as the world’s oldest religion,the oldest civilization etc etc.The history of your land is only a few hundred years old.Life goes around in circles,one that is at the zenith definitely has to come down at a point so why should America be an exception?
I will not agree with Rahul when he says that American kids are ruined,maybe he is not being specific and detailed or maybe he is evaluating from the Indian viewpoint of parenting.
”I have been to India many times and observed many Indians in the US. While there are many types of parents, I have noticed a propensity of Indian children to be spoiled and immature, maybe because their parents need their skills checked?”
Dear Rebecca,if Indian parenting skills were bad producing immature children how come the nation still survives managing a billion citizens,having dangers surrounding it from all sides added to its own internal problems.
Hahaha. That was very funny….sorry couldn’t help laughing. If its any comfort to you Rahul, my kids are as American or as Indian as a young kid can be. They play video games (is it american or Indian?), they listen to the latest music (is it american or Indian?), they eat dal, rice, pizza, pasta (american or Indian?)….they volunteer (very, very American) they go to Bal gurukul to learn about our culture and are learning an Indian language, slokas, yoga,etc (very, very Indian). My daughter wears kurtis, salwars (very Indian) and jeans (very american) with equal ease….she just wears them appropriately according to the occasion. My son follows the universal dress code for guys of ripped jeans, so there is nothing more Indian or American in that. They go bowling, play lazer tags, love the beach, love their tv and cell phones……in short they just love being kids nothing un-indian or un-american in that.
We also celebrate and observe most Indian/ Hindu festivals while I bake during Christmas (though I am not Christian). My mom back in India says to me why I even bother celebrating the festivals and other rituals when people back in India are abandoning them? My only answer is that my kids need to have a sense of identity and I want them to be grounded. It is not about religion or nationality, it is about core beliefs that define you as a person.
Coming to the concept or marriage/ divorce. I am seeing more divorces in my Indian relatives and friends than my friends and relatives living in America…unbelievable isn’t it? It is sad but it is true. The culture or divorce is more to do with how financially you are independent than a certain religion or country. If you can afford alimony or if you have a stable high paying job/ inheritance, then a girl or a guy will not think twice about divorce when marital life seems like a dead end. Trust me, if Indians were rich overall as a society, there would be no difference between the divorce rate in India vs the western cultures.
So now I have a question to you – what does being “American” or “Indian” or “Canadian”, etc mean???? To a kid it doesn’t mean anything as long as they have their Nintendo
We should learn a few things from our kids.
I forgot to add a disclaimer to my comments I made. I have lived only in India and the US all my life. I don’t know much about the cultures of Australia, Canada, UK or any other western society, but I guess it would not be much different from what I have stated previously.
@Marcy ……i give up….i don actually know myself what being American/Canadian etc means. I am totally confused.
BTW ur name sounds very similar to my friend’s ex-wife who was a American :-p
From your comments, one can understand you are confused….know yourself and what you want first…..consider everyone’s advice, but with a grain of salt…..understand that the world is becoming a smaller place and it is getting more homogeneous (like it or not)…..if you do not know where you stand then please do not come to conclusions based on what was painted with a broad brush by somebody else…..trust your experiences and compare with your presumptions in total honesty and you will find your answers. We cannot tell you which place is best for you….you have to come to that conclusion yourself….just like Sharell did…..there is no right and wrong answer to this.
hahaha.. i like i like
Very Very Funny !
But why are you changing the format of your site everyday. I am specially not at ease with the unsymmetrical expansion of ‘recent comments’ section. It should either reside in one column or in two column but not half in here and half in there. Don’t mind but I have just the best interest of design of this favorite site.
Hmmm, I’m not changing the format of my site every day. I had to replace a plug in that stopped working. I didn’t realise it wasn’t aligning properly. It looks fine on my computer. I’ll have to investigate. Thanks!
Abhi fixed hogaya, kyaa?
हाँ , हो गया ! एकदम झकास !
शारैल बहुत बुद्धिमान लड़की है
Indeed, and I could read that all by myself AND understand it as well! Surprised myself even. But you’ve spelled my name wrong!!
(Oh, let’s not get started with that again. I have come to accept the fact that it can have many spellings in Hindi… as long as it has a “long a”).
its funny when you kind of erase that cultural side.. sweet.
am a hard core Fan. being an indian who lived outside long, am finding it hard to be in india now. ..a reverse culture shock case.. am adapting
I am sure your in laws do think you are a she devil. They all do. They just don’t tell us…
haha this is too funny…
Very funny, I love it !
Very funny indeed I love it too !
Oh, I love your website! You have some beautiful products there. 8)
hmm.. seems like someone’s been hanging out lot on Reddit lately.
this is great! love it.
))
Too funny. love it love it love it.x
Adorable! I’m sending this to my best friend who’s married to an Indian! hahahahahaha
LOL that is the funniest photo ever! even though I’m not married to an Indian, I’m dateing a Pakistani man, everyone looks at me almost the same way. That photo made me laugh soo hard!
OMG…its so funny and so true!!!! Thanks for this post Sharell. My day coulnd’t be started better then this. Will keep smile on my face whole day whenever I’ll think of it.
Keep posting such nice things……
Ha!ha…hilarious but true…have you ever tried cooking for your in-laws!?
I’m from Karnataka married to malayali, me a vegetarian, he a sworn non-vegetarian…just imagine my plight when my in-laws visit us! So, I was wondering how your in-laws react to your cooking!
I have actually! There was one time when my sister in law’s mother in law was visiting from Orissa, and of course she couldn’t believe that a white girl could cook Indian food. So, my sister in law asked me to prepare a full dinner to prove her wrong (she knew that I’d learned enough)! I made most of the dishes my mother in law had taught me — fish curry, a bhaji, dal and rice. They really liked it! (Although it wasn’t salty enough for my brother in law).
I can imagine it would be really challenging to cook meat when you have never done so before. Cooking meat requires extra skill to make sure it doesn’t get over done and becomes tough and chewy.
Sharell wrote”I can imagine it would be really challenging to cook meat when you have never done so before. Cooking meat requires extra skill to make sure it doesn’t get over done and becomes tough and chewy.”
You bet!, I keep running to my hubby dear every 5 mins with a little bit of meat so that he can tell whether it done. So far the in-laws have been generous with their praises about my cooking, since I have never tasted my non-vegetarian dishes, I don’t know whether it really tastes good or are they being very kind.
Good to know that you have mastered the fish curry, I once tried making traditional Kerala Fish curry, but tore the recipe when my better half had to guzzle almost two bottles of water to down his food. The fish which he ate had enough water in his stomach to actually swim.
I think it would be soooo hard emotionally as well to cook meat if you’re a vegetarian, so you’re doing really well. I’m non veg, and sometimes I even hate cooking meat and touching it!
hahahaha, Kya baat hai!
I need to see my fiance’s reaction.
Mazaa hoga!
I love this conversation! mazaa hoga, zaroor!
“Mazaa Hoga!” nahin .. “Maza aayega”
If you say “Mazaa Hoga”, most probably the person will hand you mango soft-drink “Maaza’ or will say “Nahin, Slice chalega” ..
Oh yes, of course, you’re right. Silly me. I know it’s “mazaa aaya” when you’ve enjoyed your dinner, so of course, it would be “mazaa aayega”.
i loved it !!!!
You are funny!
So funny I really loved it.As a matter of fact whether a daughter- in-law is indian or foriegner or whatever almost every mother feels she has put some spell on her son.
funny! Your site is very interesting. I’m a German living in the US married to an Indian. Need to read more about your India experiences in case we move to India…:)
This is hilarious! I love the ‘What my family thinks I do’ photo: just a sexy siren lying around in gorgeous jewelled lingerie! How fabulous!
But the last picture is definitely the truth… though you’re a little taller and fairer skinned than that lady
Yeah, and I never wear an apron when cooking.
Hope you are not cooking in jewelled underwear without apron ; it is dangerous
Well yes, it sounds like it could be! Are you speaking from experience?
Thats why she is even calling herself “Jewel”
LOL
Funny stuff!
Bronwyn,
Last picture may be true but it is a sad picture.
There should be a man standing next to that woman in that last
picture , helping her.
I think in every marriage, husband and wife should both cook.
Cooking together is best (soooooooo romantic).
But if that is not possible everyday(due to work schedule), then at least husband should cook on 3 out of 7 days, wife should cook on the other three and 1 day could be reserved for the restaurant.
Not fair that only one person has to cook
This applies even if the wife is a housewife(does not work outside). The reason is because she works at home and that is also work.
Husbands reading this, try cooking for your wife at least once – if you have not done so already. If you are not a good cook use some good cooking book and get your wife’s last minute advice on the taste/more or less salt etc.. Or let her watch and teach you while you cook.
on this planet.
Trust me, it will change your romantic life if you do it regularly.
I am a guy and this tip is for my fellow men
Guys if you are not cooking for your wives, you don’t know what you are missing
While I do agree all guys need to learn cooking as a life skill and to survive or to feed healthy meals for their family, I however disagree that a married couple HAVE to cook together. Cooking is not the “only” way a couple can bond or show respect for each other and here’s why.
I find cooking therapeutic and cannot stand having my husband being in the kitchen with me, judging me, looking over my shoulder constantly, asking questions or generally making a whole lot more noise and mess. I prefer cooking with my kids because they “listen” to me and are eager to learn (which is not the case with my know-it-all husband) and things happen on my terms. I however appreciate his help around the house…..just not the cooking…..a girl’s got to have her domain, don’t you think? He does the cooking when I am out of town, but then I don’t get to deal with the mess, so that’s okay. Also men who cook have this attitude that they don’t need to depend on their wife’s cooking…..it is a let down for a foodie like me when people say they don’t need you or your cooking.
Having said that, if the guy’s a better cook or if the couple are on equal footing in terms of who gets the say in the kitchen, then by all means go ahead and enjoy cooking together. Just know that being a couple doesn’t mean doing “everything” together or sharing chores equally. It is all about respect and empathy for each other. If both understand this they have a working relationship even though to outsiders it may seem unequally divided.
I did not say they ‘HAVE’ to cook together – that is not possible in many cases.
Also, I did not say it was the ‘only’ way to bond nor the ‘only’ way to show empathy. Yes, I agree that mutual respect and empathy (and honesty/truth, love) are most important in a marriage.
But I do not agree on the unequal division of work – especially if difference is so much that it is even noticeable to outsiders. The unequal division(unless the person doing more work insists on it or if the other is incapacitated to do more work) shows lack of understanding of equality and hence lack empathy and mutual respect.
For example: when both husband and wife return home after a long day at work, it is unfair to the wife that when they both come home tired, the husband is with his other wife(the TV) while the real wife is cooking in the kitchen.
If the wife prefers him to stay away then fine. But a husband should not take it for granted that a woman’s place is in the kitchen.
That is lack of respect and empathy for wife if he assumes this.
If a wife does 90% of the work while the husband does only 10%, they will still have a working relationship, as they did 5000 years ago in post vedic era of India. They probably thought that they had mutual respect and empathy for each other too. But the concept of equality was different then.
It is the duty of any good husband to make sure that he treats his wife as an equal- and vice versa. Also, if wife does most of the work, the the children will assume that this inequality is OK and normal.
They do not have to do everything together or divide everything equally exactly – that is mathematically very difficult. But each side (the husband for example) should make an honest and sincere effort that the other is not overburdened. If the wife is doing most of the work and the husband makes no effort to help her , then the relationship is not healthy. Even if they both think it is.
As an example: an Afghani female friend of mine was scared of marriage because although her mom and dad had a great (mutually respecting) relationship (in their view), she (their daughter) thought that her mom did most of the work and hence women have low status as a wife. Her mom never complained. She said this is normal. I think it does affect others (children) who witness such an unequal relationships.
The main problem here is that mutual respect and empathy are terms that mean different for everyone. For example, in some cultures (like saudi arabia) , not allowing a wife to drive or even beating a wife by husband is considered respectful by both because it is for her own good. Many men and women brainwashed by this idea of inequality will assume that this beating is OK and will say it does not show a lack of empathy or respect. Some go to the extent of saying that husband is doing it for the sake of making his wife a better person (out of love).
It is possible such a couple will never divorce nor will the wife ever complain. But that is because she is tolerating everything silently and trying to convince herself that this is normal.
The gist of what I am saying: Husband wife should treat each other as equals. No stereotyping(wife’s place is in the kitchen etc.).
Mutual respect and empathy are very subjective terms . Hence very unequally divided work ; except in cases where it is absolutely necessary (husband works 12 hrs a day or husband is paralyzed etc.) is unhealthy even though it may seem like a working relationship to both. And children get affected by witnessing this unequally divided labor in a relationship.
Marcy:
Just wanted to add that my comment(26th) is very general.
In your case, your logic makes perfect sense. Because you prefer to cook without him. And hence he is respecting you by giving you your space. That is very good.
I was talking about many other cases where the wife hopes that her husbands shares some household duties instead of taking her for granted. That is why the last picture was sad because it stereotyped the centuries old idea of the wife’s place being in the kitchen.
Ocean,
A lady in the kitchen is a sad picture for you?
You are assuming many things I wonder. Do you think the lady was forced in to kitchen? Do you assume her husband never helped her in the kitchen.(Its just a picture and believe me pictures never tell the whole story). I know whatever you are saying is your personal preference but idea of romance is different for everyone. I don’t think this lady in the kitchen doesn’t like being there.
From your point of view, should this lady be at the office of her husband and vice-versa while he is doing a day’s hard work? And seriously you can’t decide for the whole tribes of men to make their wives happy.
No offense meant. Just my point of view.
Not to barge in the middle of a perfectly good argument here, but I think it is about time we just removed this separation of workload altogether. Two kitchens, separate utensils, cook what you want and eat. Work for your food, if you dont you starve. No favors. No quarrels. Flatmates is a perfectly good way to live. Why should married life mean suffering through someone else’s cooking while listening to the never ending complaints? I have never heard any woman say recently that they do all of this out of love. Then why do it? I can cook a perfectly good meal by myself after a full days work thank you very much.
Seeya,
If you were addressing me, I didn’t actually get your point. My fault. But I would like to request you to please explain in more clear words.
Gosh, why am I not able to reply to seeya? lol…..Why should married life mean suffering through someone else’s cooking while listening to the never ending complaints? Answering your question, I do it for love…..not the kind of love you are thinking, not for the hubby, but for the love of cooking…..they are my guinea pigs but looks like thats where they want to be
Chanakya, man or woman the kitchen seems to get a bad rap in the middle of all this….sad!!!
Good for you Seeya. But IMHO, your argument/sarcasm is not logical. You probably missed parts of my argument about equal workload – the February 26, 2012 at 1:12 pm (long) argument.
When did I say that a woman is incapable of making dinner after a full day of work? Most people (men and women) can. If you can do it then it is not a big deal. If you like cooking for your husband after a hard day at work while he does not contribute at all (implied) – then do it – but do not expect that from your DIL(bahu). If husband contributes (maybe not in cooking but in other stuff)- then we are on the same side – there is no difference of opinion then.
Your situation or Marcy’s situation do not represent all families nor do they represent the attitudes of all women.
So if you base your arguments on what happens in your individual cases, these arguments do not hold much water. I am not basing my arguments on one or two examples (although I gave one). I am basing them on the general concept of equality between man and wife. By equality, I do NOT mean that they do every task equally(divide by 2).
My ONLY point is that there has to be equal (or an honest effort to make equal) contributions overall. Its not just about who makes dinner. Its about equal workload. Husband working in the office is also a contribution. I repeat, unequal division of labor is not healthy. Even if the wife ‘thinks’ she is doing it out of love.
See my previous argument(feb 26th) where I said that some women in middle east ‘think’ that their husband beats them out of ‘love’. So they become better wives. That is how harmful the concept of inequality can be.
Let me clarify one more time. I have no issue if the wife does 100% of cooking as long as there is equal division of labor overall.
And equal division of labor does not mean you have to live like flatmates, have two kitchens etc. So that is why your sarcasm is illogical.
[Here is just one example, but my argument is not based on this one example alone]
We know a case of a family friend’s daughter in mumbai where the MIL was so used to the concept of inequality that she fired her cook after her son married and brought home a DIL. MIL expected DIL to do everything because that is her ‘duty’ as a ‘loving’ wife. No concept of equality between sexes. DIL would work in office too. Needless to say, the marriage ended in a divorce.The DIL wanted to be treated equally and not be taken for granted, so I do not blame her at all. It is possible that some other DIL(brought up with same mindset of inequality) would have tolerated everything and there would have been no divorce – but that does not mean the relationship ‘worked’.
Chanakya,
No offense taken.
Your points are valid.
If the lady in the picture likes being there or her husband has even tried to help, then I do not have any issue. Then we are on the same side here.
Then our discussion boils down to what the picture implies.
Chanakya, sorry, my bad. I was replying inthe context of the entire conversation here. Usually these discussions on cooking go like – how much cooking should each of hubby/wife do. So I just suggested that split it up altogether.
Ocean, you do not have to be sorry for anything….you’ve contributed to a healthy discussion and probably have given some points to think about to other readers. I generally don’t comment, but was compelled to when you mentioned specific examples, but your later comments provide further explanations and truly show you do not come from a place of bias.
We are all on the same side and I do agree with you in how majority of the people confuse social norms with basic human decency. I also agree that one should not impose their beliefs (biased or otherwise) onto others (as in the case of Mils expecting their DILs to have the same kind of relationship that she would have experienced).
Speaking of your family friend, even my best friend divorced her hubby for very similar reasons. I generally do not judge/ take sides of people who divorce since we get to see/ listen to only one side of the story, but I do support my friend in finding happiness and if divorce is the answer to her (or everyone involved) happiness, then so be it.
Just to clarify I didn’t base on just my situation I have seen many happy couples and unhappy ones, divorced, living separately, you name it….the conclusion is based on the commonalities of all these relationships….the only thing common that I found among successful couples was the ones who had respect for each other (more than love, it was respect)
Somehow there was no reply button to your latest comment, hence putting my viewpoints here.
Ocean, I responded because you made very specific remarks such as “…then at least husband should cook on 3 out of 7 days, wife should cook on the other three and 1 day could be reserved for the restaurant.
Not fair that only one person has to cook
This applies even if the wife is a housewife(does not work outside)…”
While your explanations below make sense there are subtle differences from what I think. It is difficult to quantify work done around the house and hence the terms equal/ unequal is a rather hopeless point to focus on. If a couple pick chores that they excel in or enjoy (or rather do not mind doing) then I believe that is how work should be divided. This erases any stereotyping that might arise.
The other major point I disagree is that mutual respect and empathy are not subjective terms. One might confuse them with societal norms or generational trends but they are universally true just like love. I say this because they exist even in the animal world.
Coming to the specific example of your Afghan friend, I still repeat myself – If a couple understand the concept of respect and empathy, they have a working relationship even though to outsiders it may seem unequally divided – the child of the parent is still an outsider and doesn’t know the dynamics between the husband and wife. There is a saying, even the air doesn’t know what happens between a husband and wife.
Having said that, this is where respect should be demonstrated by each parent giving due credit to their spouse in front of their child now and then. It is one thing to do work because it is expected of you and a totally different thing because that is what you want to do for your family. My answer to your Afghani friend is in your statement itself. She somehow equates doing work to low status. Work is work and there is nothing high or low about it, irrespective of whether you do it at home and do not get paid for it or whether you attend board meetings and get fat bonuses. If one takes pride in their work you do not need other people, money or praise to validate your feeling.
It could have been that your Afghani friend’s mother never vocalized her husband’s efforts thus resulting in the child seeing only one side of the picture. Same can be said with the husband not appreciating his wife’s efforts resulting in your friend viewing it somehow as low status. The problem here is no proper communication between family members. Your friend’s viewpoint would never change even if her father was a hardworking farmer who had to wake up at the break of dawn and do back breaking work because she either doesn’t see her father work or doesn’t hear the same from her mother. I wouldn’t be so quick in judging what happens between couples….there are many possibilities.
I say all this because at various points of my life, I have been the carefree-never-helping-around-the-house-always-studying kind of daughter to my parents, a housewife to my husband, a stay-at-home mom to my kids and a full time employee-cum-working mom; and every stage has helped me learn and grow. Through all of this and observing the kind of relationships of parents, grandparents and others across generations and culture, the only thing that was common among all couples was one of mutual respect and empathy…..heck it even trumps love sometimes.
Well, I agree that empathy and respect are often confused with
social norms or culture. That is exactly why they become subjective when in practice. Animals (usually) do not a have a custom or culture, they base most things such as empathy/respect on their conscience.
If empathy and respect are used in their true sense, using only conscience and common sense, not social norms then I agree with your statement. Unfortunately, some people equate them with customs.
Just to lighten the mood
From artofliving by Sri Sri RaviShankar,
Here is a nice 3 minute video on ‘how to deal with extremely difficult husbands’ – a woman asks Sri Sri about how to deal with a lazy husband who makes her do all the work and has fun all day long
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-nt8zX5udPw
Seeya and Marcy:
I am sorry – I did not mean to imply that it is bad that you cook for your husband and he does not help. Many women love to cook and even experiment. I admire your selfless attitude and love for your family members. And I am sure that he must be helping in other ways.
I was speaking of the wrong stereotype only(woman’s place is in the kitchen). That is why in the movie ,’Father of the Bride-I’, the bride(Kimberly Williams) who is a talented architect gets very upset when her fiance(George Newbern) gifts her some cooking utensil.
My overall sentiment is that husband and wife have equal status .
The workload(not cooking in particular) has to be equally adjusted based on situation so that one person is not over-burdened. For example if husband is sick he cannot be expected to do any chores. Same if wife is sick – husband cannot expect her to cook.
Marcy’s example is perfect, because in her case the workload was adjusted based on empathy and mutual respect and priorities.
I am in 100% in agreement with Marcy regarding the need for empathy and mutual-respect; but these two values should come out of conscience and common sense(as they did in her case) , not out of social norms as they do in many cultures (like the one I mentioned previously – Saudi Arabia).
haha! True that.
Lol! That’s a funny image.
I haven’t seen such a high level of digression in any other comment section.
And Sharell, I usually find your comment section very entertaining. People here jump to random issues and topics that are completely unrelated to the post. It’s amusing, but I wonder if you find such tangential comments annoying.
Oh Pepper, this is so mild compared to what it used to be. Every single post that I wrote got hijacked.
Hence, why I had to introduce an independent moderator to keep things in check. It was not only annoying but very stressful when people used to just pick fights with each other.
Sharell I loved the image:) I am an Armenian girl married to an Indian man. Love your blog. Thanks:)
Hi Sharell, I wondered if your name is correctly written in hindi or not(on your website), to me, if i read it in hindi it is sounding – Shaaarel, which I think is not correct. Just a thought…….
Hi Vineet, it is indeed Shaa-rel with a long “a”. I wrote it in Hindi so that people would realise it’s not pronounced the same way as “Sheryl” or “Cheryl”. It’s a completely different name. It’s almost impossible for any Indian to pronounce my name the right way, even when I tell them. So far, I’ve met only 2!
Try as we may, the image of a western women does not change in the minds of even educated Indians. Hollywood and English serials kind of reinforce this view. However, like the saas bahu serials, these movies and serials present an exaggerated and wrong image of the western society. We get confused whether they use sexuality to sell their films or they are just like that. The boundary between truth and reality often get blurred. We Indians are burdened by our ancient culture and mind you it is not a light burden. It muddles our mind. The pressure to do the right thing all the time according to customs, robs us of all objectivity. A western person does not get bothered by either religion or tradition. It is there but it not breathing down his neck all the time. This freedom is often perceived as immorality by us. I wish our minds are less cluttered and we can breath easy. Our religion and culture are our both our biggest strength and our biggest weakness.
It’s quite sad really. I don’t know why western women are always getting the blame, especially when it comes to divorces etc. All my divorced friends that I know of (including myself) in most cases it was the western man who wanted to end the marriage and behaved in various improper ways.
The behaviour of men everywhere is usually overlooked.
I’m reading an interesting book at the moment and it discusses different cultural/social structures over the ages, and India is definitely a tribal power one, with set codes of conduct etc, one whereas western society has evolved into an individual power one, which encourages freedom of choice. They are two completely different ways of thinking and living.
It is the western concept of beauty which often baffles the Indian mind. The term used for a beautiful women is “hot” of “sexy”. All beautiful women are defined in the same way.
Any blond with an aggressive attitude is termed as beautiful or for that matter any aggressive women is beautiful. Femininity is not given much importance. The women has to be as aggressive as men in order to be called beautiful. This kind of sexual imagery is very confusing. I may be wrong, but I have never seen any western women blush in any of the films or serials. Perhaps blushing is not part of western culture. In east, a women must be feminine in order to be beautiful. So, for a Indian man, the western women is sexy and for a western man the Indian women is submissive or exotic. Though both are the same from inside. It is not a criticism but an observation. This overemphasis on sexiness is something I find needless and often confusing.
Oh blushing is very much a part of western culture, but it’s hard to blush on demand (its more of an involuntary action), plus it probably wouldn’t be seen under all the movie makeup they have to wear!
The paradox of India is that those beautiful submissive young women have the potential to turn into bossy ole aunties as they get older!
Blushing in the west is usually linked with unexperience or innocence, it is considered sweet in young girls but ridiculous in women. If you watch period films from Merchant & Ivory for example (Room with a View etc) however, you will see a lot of shy ladies blushing and so on.
Cold women are sometimes thought to hate men. But it’s even tougher for women of power in the west.
Toquiville once wrote about Americans… and did address American women in a couple of chapters. He did this in 1980s.. but many of his observations still hold true IMO.
This is what he said..comparing American women with French/Europeans. I believe this could apply to Ozzies as well
Quote
“An American girl scarcely ever displays that virginal softness in the midst of young desires or that innocent and ingenuous grace which usually attend the European woman in the transition from girlhood to youth. It is rare that an American woman, at any age displays childish timidity or ignorance. Like the young women Europe she seeks to please, but she knows precisely the cost of pleasing. If she does not abandon herself to evil, at least she knows that it exists; and she is remarkable rather for purity of manners than for chastity of mind. “
oh man,
Rahul u r too funny bud, sharell u have some funny ppl here, rahul is just like my wife (cutely ignorant) when he said people need to drink to keep themselves warm. I hope you will meet sumone who will spoil(in indian terms) you to the core. Now he has hijacked your blog sharell, we dont need u mate, i got an interesting indian here. and i hope ur moderator will post his comments regularly. If he leave your blog please make a fake rahul.
P.S. I love you sharell
Yeah, they’re quite a hoot hey! We have had funnier, but things started getting out of hand before the new moderation policy. I like to publish a few sometimes though, cos they really break the monotony.
Thanks for sharing this post. My husband doesn’t cook once a week for us, but everyday! and he does the laundry too! Laughs. My hubby is amazing husband!
So why is it wrong for guys to look for a woman who would do their laundry and cook for them everyday?
Yeah for women who cook and do the laundry everyday!
I think “looking” for a partner based on whether he/ she does certain chores or not is highly over rated thanks to mushy movies and soap operas who dictate how a guy or a gal need to behave in a relationship. The degree of time and effort involved in chores vary depending on life stages and just because a person would do chores as a single does not mean that the same person would like doing chores after many years say when kids come into picture, etc. The reverse is also true, just because you grew up not doing chores, doesn’t mean you will not do when your lifestyle changes.
Relationship between couples is a tango and one figures out along the way what works for them and their situation at any given time. So one should look for a partner who complements him/ her and is ready to lead when the other falls behind. Both must look for intangible characteristics like work ethic, respect, empathy and flexibility in thought rather than on superficial traits such as whether one can cook, clean, run errands, etc. It is safe to say that a hard working person who values dignity of labor and is humble will easily be able to do chores without expecting much in return and that is a very appealing quality to have whether you are a girl or a guy.
So to add to Manny’s comment – Yeah to all those folks men or women who make things go smoothly for their family.
Oh all these comments are starting to give me some sort of complex . My husband is in the kitchen cooking fish for dinner . I made him close the door so the smell won’t come in the drawing room and the only reason I will set foot in there in a few minutes is to make myself a drink
I think I’ll pass on doing UthinkIdo tonight !
LOL.. strangely enough, if we choose not to sugarcoat the truth, the image is bang-on from every angle!! With the exception of the 2nd on i.e what your parents think you do… I doubt anyone in the west thinks Indian women live like that!! lol.. Sharell the warrior princess!! Quite a sight that would make!
and I see the your never ending debates havent ceased!! Keep fighting, is all I can say!
Vequise, the second photo is not a warrior princess, it is from Star Wars, and that is Princess Leia, trapped in slavery.
But you really are a writer, not just a woman in the kitchen..
nice to know all this…
sharell, your views are really thoughtful…you really made life easy for different culture people……………………lolz
Hi Sharell,
I just came across this site of yours. here you have done a great job. I have never read that much on any site so far.
I am an Australian born and brought up in India. have been living here for a while now. Love Australia (Expect weather). I don’t know what part of Melbourne you lived in but 80% of people I know hates this weather.
There are lot of times when people start thinking about a culture after reading the news or watching TV. Most of my friends living in India thinks Australia is a racist country, they (Australians) don’t like Indians. But the fact is it’s a great place to live and work and I think they way people treat there kids here is far better than those of India. As they make kids dependent on themselves. kids are more bold to take there own decisions.
Over here I found people are quite laid back. Other thing which is really common is mix marriage. You can name a mix and you will find it here.
People here don’t drink to keep themselves warm. they drink to socialize Drinking here is considered as bad thing as people drink sensibly.
So for me I think western countries are all the same but still at the back of my mind I know Australia is unique and USA, UK or any other western country don’t have same culture and traditions.
Hey Sumit, thanks very much!
Haha, everyone hates Melbourne weather. I actually come from a town two hours east of Melbourne and it’s even worse there. It gets so cold at night there are frosts.
I’m so happy to hear that you love living in Australia. Living away from it, and coming in touch with people from other western countries (UK and US), I’ve been able to see how unique Australia really is. Crazy place! The thing is about most Aussies, they will be friendly, but they like to see people from other countries mixing in and “having a go”. A lot of migrants keep to themselves and their traditions — and this is where the issues start, because no one can get an understanding of each other if people don’t integrate. And, of course, the Indian media is a bit to blame for how they portray Australia in India. They tend to sensationalise stories and play up racism, unfortunately. Another issue with Aussies is that they like to insult people — not harmfully, but in jest. It’s easy to take it the wrong way.
Anyway, keep enjoying the Land of Oz! 8)
Hi Sharell,well i think its the common lifestyle of alll mumbaikars…the men after makin money….in the office…some honest people take their company as their other family n they work all day and even at night for the company…n ofcourse to make miney for their wfe and kids..
so its obvious for the wife to get bored at home…so lifes like that in mumbai…why don you move with your husband to australia…well atleast you will be closer to your family and can spend some of the time with them…i would like to move to ma wifes country…coz i value the sacrifice she did for me by leavin her country…n i don like to be in India…north or south east or west….i was prayin to God to get me out of this country n i will the happiest person when i leave this country…………..
Hi Sunil, it’s not the right time for us to move to Australia. What would we do there? Our work (both mine and his) is here in India. And fortunately, we don’t have the typical life that you mention. We both work from home and have very flexible jobs, so plenty of freedom and thankfully no office involved.
If we ever move to Australia, I would like to continue to keep it that way!